kwinland said:

H.B.M.C. said:

VERY cool!  I missed that announcement!

At least it is a start....

Yeah, Eldar Rangers or Eldar Outcasts would have been the no-brainer.  Harlequins have adventure potential, but usually travel in troupes - GREAT flavour for a coterie-based campaign!

Cheers,

Ken

Yeah the new adventure book might just be the first step in getting such a book. Perhaps we could just get an expansion for all the xenos playable races, like some sort of compendiary for Rogue trader.

Ie more paths, gear, cybernetics, and planets/history for Kroot, Orks, and Dark Eldar.

Reading more of Path of the Renegade, I'm getting the feeling that Ranger isn't all it's cracked up to be, in regards to integrating them in to a game. It's described in the novel (I know, I know) that it's basically just another Path for the Eldar, as restrictive and confining in its own way, and there largely just to have a place to put the "bored and disafftected".

And now I can't decide whether Corsairs would be the same (in their own way), or whether they'd have actually achieved the goal of freeing themselves from the Parths. But as I said previously, either option leaves them with less incentive to sign up with a bunch of humans, than the inherently ambitious Dark Eldar.

Im with Blood Pact on this one

Playing creature with mindset much more narrow than Space Marine isnt great material for RPG, it was hard to RP space marine for more than 30 gaming sessions, now imagine someone who limit himsealf to just one aspect of warfare or life, also no or as little emotions as possible. 

PS: Eldar corebook should be named "Love can bloom"

Having finished the book, I'd say that the Dark Eldar really do seem to actually the best option available for player Characters. Corsairs are also viable, but there's a number of reasons to go eith Dark Eldar over them, such as simple fact that they have a tabletop army (ie: they're actually catering to 40K players, specifically Dark Eldar fans). And thinking of the Rangers in a new light, it always did seem that while they could wander far and wide, it did always seem to be for a greater purpose to the craftworld (collecting lost soulstones, patrolling the Webway and Maiden worlds, etc.).

But getting back to the Dark Eldar, you can count on their mercenary attitude, and that they'll always look out for their own best interests first. Any Rogue Trader worth their Warrant should be able to ensure those interests are the same as their interests. And in threads elsewhere it's been alluded to that the upcoming book is just crammed full of great Dark Eldar info... I'm really hoping there will be stats for Reaver Jetbikes. But I'm personally positive we'll see at least as much as there was for Orks and Kroot. And while some will no doubt bitch and moan about the reprinting of old material, like Dark Eldar weapon stats, I'll be quite glad to have them all condensed in one spot. I'd rather not have to dig through Into the Storm for my Splinter Pistol's stats.

Actually, corsairs do have an army list, though it's Forgeworld material (it's in their latest Imperial Armour book). As for the rangers, yes, they will usually take a request from their craftworld or do something that benefits it, but that should hardly come as a surprise. They are eldar, they will likely look out for the interests of other eldar, especially ones they know; I'd expect that they'd be willing to give a hand to exodites or harlequins, too (probably not Dark Eldar though - frakking renegade scum). As for having a narrower viewpoint than Space Marines, that comes as a bit of a surprise to me. Space marines are supposed to have years of indoctrination before they are actually considered true marines, including when they sleep (hypno-doctrination); then the vast majority of their waking time is spent either training or fighting. I doubt the space elf hobo assassins can beat that.

On the other hand, the Eldar already played a significant role in one of the RT adventures, and they missed including a career for them there. Soul Reaver gave as much as could be hoped for under the circumstances. I still wonder if "Only War" wouldn't work much better as a Dark Heresy book, but I imagine the DH rules are starting to show their age. Still, I'm not keen on spending 60 dollars so I have a rule errata... and I've never cared [b]that[/b] much about the Guard.

@Boruta 666 - how about "From Ulthwe with love" ? . I'd rather paint it on the side of a D-Cannon, though ;) .

That's the thing that's not covered as much, because the Codex only covers a limited part of it, they really are more limited. They focus on the various 'Paths' as a way of staving off temptation and falling in to the decadance that consumed their race in the past, and while they hardly are required to be aesthetics, they live rigid lives by necessity. A Striking Scorpion, Warlock, Painter, and Ranger might come together to go on 'adventures' from time to time (mainly battles), but they don't move in the same social circles necessary to all just hang out together in their off hours as well, to provide a proper game. And it's infinitely less likely that they'd ride around on a starship with a bunch of mon'keigh. Even if just because the the Dark Eldar 'class' being a Kabalite Warrior meaning the Craftworld equivalent would be a Guardian.

I haven't seen the Imperial Armour book with Corsairs yet, but previous material on them did lead me to believe they'd make a good choice. But like I said, the Dark Eldar simply have more prestige when it comes to the 40K audience that the games are aimed at. I'm sure some folks really would prefer and many more appreciate having the Corsairs fleshed out in the RPG more than they generally have been in the wargame. But I know a lot more people (and so does FFG) would want to play the Dark Eldar. Myself included (me and another player are planning on making a pair of Dark Eldar, and slowly subverting control of the ship). There's a wealth of material to work with, much of it brand spanking new from their awesome Codex, and FFG can tap in to that with the excellent style they've been doing so far with most everything in the game.

Harlequins would make a great game on their own actually. They all have a reason to be together in a group, there's a variety of 'classes' to play, they're something wholly new. It'd probably be about the same XP level as Deathwatch though, but opinion of that is up to personal preference, really. They would also be a good choice for including in to a RT game, except for what I said about XP level. Harlequins are far beyond even the respectable skills of a Kabalite Warrior.

Eldar core book would be great but  it is  hard to find good main theme and different careers. As I am reading your posts I see that you are all thinking in similar way. Common citizena of craftworld aren't limited to one path and they are changing them whenever they want to do so. When I am thinking about careers in Eldar core book I see only one solution for different PC. All of them would be on Path of the Outcast but most important difference would be in their past. I would make something similar to RT character creation. They will have option to chose path that they had been following before being an outcast. This solution provide you ability to have warlock, striking scorpion and painter in a team. The biggest problem for such team would be equipment beacouse its is near impossible to find scorpion claw outside the shrine.

Sorry for my English but it's not my native language.

If they could change the Paths whenever they wanted, with ease,, they wouldn't need them now would they? Or they just wouldn't be doing their job.

Consider an Exarch. Each of the types of Aspect Warrior are a different Path, emulating a different aspect of the Eldar wargod. And the Exarchs are those Eldar who become too focussed on the Path, to the point where it could be said that that focus consumes them, and they can't break away from it. Other Paths, like those of the Farseer and Warlock (?). are for life as well, albeit a willing choice. Anyway, the Exarchs aren't the only examples of Eldar who have gotten 'trapped' in a Path because they grew too focused on it, just the only ones most of us have experience with because of the game. It can and does happen to others, leaving some Eldar trapped as a painter forever, and such. They're trying to keep their souls from being eaten by a God they birthed through their own decadance and hedonism, they're not going to be that casual about this thing.

While at the same time, the focus on the Path provides many benefits. For one simple example, the fact that a former Striking Scorpion just doesn't have the same fighting skills as one that is currently following the Path, equipment aside. As if being on the Path hones their abilities in the associated field.

Though I think an Outcastes game would work, the Eldar are free from the Path, and able to explore themselves fully during that time. Though I still don't think there's as much potential to be found as with the Dark Eldar.

But how many exarch do you have on craftworld? 30? 40?  Earchs are beyond common citizens because they cant put off their warmasks. Farseers ale something like exarchs within ranks of trained psykers. You are focusing on these few cases when you can't act normaly and become trapped on one path. Yes I know that former Striking Scorpion isn't as good as one that is following the path but I wasnt saying that outcast who was within ranks of striking Scorpions is killing machine. I am talking about giving player few benefits. I don't much about Dark Eldar but i always  used to think that they are closer in way of acting and thinking to followers of Khorne or Slaneesh. Dark Eldar are pirates, murderes and slavers who love killing, torturing and causing pain to their victims.

Sorry for double post. Please delete.

FreezeZ said:

That is an accurate, but basic, assessment of the Dark Eldar.

However they are only like followers of Khorne and Slaanesh on the surface. Their motivations and desires are very different. By nature they are an ambitious race, and excellence comes easily to them. The Dark Eldar consider themselves the inheritors of the fallen Eldar Empire, and generally continue to live the decadent lifestyles they lived before The Fall. They're like the Imperium in a way, in that they're trying to deny that they've fallen from the greatness they once had.

How many exarchs on craftworld? i bet is something between 5 and 100000. Nobody know how big craftworlds are, they can be just big ships with population around 100k or less or on other hand it could be that craftworlds may house billions of eldar...

Also if u are trapped on certain path, your past before that path becomes blurry, just like some childhood dream. In One of the earlier Eldar dex there is story about exarch, how he forgets all before his current path, he was poet before, driver and many more, now he is just Aspect Warrior, he even forget his friends, lovers and such.

Also exarch is only eldar who don't need his ritual mask/helmet, he is already bound to Khaine.

From my knowledge Dark Eldar and outcasts are the only types with RP potential and sense. Also Dark Eldar have freedom of doing as they want (except being psykers), they can be bad, very bad, or very very bad, still in wh40k that makes them almost good guys. xD

PS: in eldar corebook they must put rules about eldar - human love. As we know 80% of mixed campaigns will turn into twilight in space. (sarcasm filter off)

boruta666 said:

Get real ;) . Dark Eldar may have fallen in a lot of ways, but they can still hold their own in the "Top 3 guys you never, EVER want to fall in the hands of" right there with Slaanesh daemons and the particularly vile CSM bands.

Let's have some perspective here: the ancient eldar were such extraordinary, mind-blowing psychopaths they created the Chaos God of excess, kink, and mind-numbing nastiness by having their dead souls coalesce in the warp. Dark Eldar started like that and have had millenia to refine their wicked ways. That merits some respect, here.