If a player wanted to play a violent Bothan that should not only be fine but normal.  There are many reasons for this.  The first being that violent Bothans clearly exist.  Physically weak wookies also clearly exist.  Do not "Planet of Hats" an entire species, that's absurd.  If there are a million bothans then there is a bell curve of their violent tendencies, there will always MANDATORILY be a Bothan that is the most violent Bothan out of a million until there is less than a million Bothans.  Saying there are not violent Bothans is like saying there aren't tall asians. On average people of asian heritage are shorter than caucasian people but Yao Ming is just one person and he is very tall.  He is not AVERAGE but that's kind of the point of playing a PC isn't it.

Cyril said:

I blew up Coruscant once for a campaign idea… Lucas didn't show up and make me take it back. :)

…

Of course, I had one player refuse to play because it altered canon Star Wars too much… some people just have a problem using their imagination. tsk tsk tsk.

----------

Regarding Species and their bonuses… I have a problem with the Gand. I really think the Intellect should be 2 and Presence 1. Or I think they should be given an option to start with Mechanics 1 because they are tinkerers, but having an Intellect 2 would just make more sense.

deanruel said:

Dude!  Wow!  You're not going off on what I was saying.  I have NO problem with a violent Bothan.  Bothan society wouldn't accept it, and that is fine.  The player of said Bothan, and myself, are in agreement on it.  

One of the options that the player asked was about growing up an orphan on another planet.  Again I had no problem with it.

So it led me to the question of species perks.  Looking at them they come from being raised in a specific type of society.  Bothans heavily favor verbal resolution, the society as a whole promotes debate in every feasible manner. That is where the skills (species bonuses) come from.  They are learned, not something a race is born with, like claws, fangs, or a highly sensitive nose.  A bonus for tracking, based of said sensitive nose, would be biologic.

So, given that, having the bothan grow-up in another culture, it stands to reason that he/she would adapt that cultures methods. So, if they grew-up on Rodia, they are all about the hunt. 

I was just asking if that broke anything, as I am not a numbers cruncher.  I got my answer, but it still leaves an interesting topic.   

Nobody is arguing that deviances don't exist in a society.  Chewie is a prime example, however his being a runt didn't isolate him from wookie society.  Other things would, for example, if he were to use his climbing claws to kill people.   

Gotcha, that gives me a good idea actually.  I'm gonna hit the books tonight and cost out the races abilities and advantages. 

I guess I simply would've sticked to the species abilities as stated, and used an appropriate  obligation to cover the Bothan society side of things. After all, I believe that's one of the (many) uses of obligations.

That being said, I understand from the various posts that you're not really arguing that, but rather if some abilities are gained primarily socially or biologically and what would happen if raised primarily away from your culture.

While I could in many instances support simply switching some abilities around and be done with it, I'd like to toss in a few thoughts on why not to, as well. It's not to send the discussion spiraling or anything, but because I feel some of these points warrants a mention.

First, the issue that was brought up about prejudice  and species/cultures is actually a good one. If the Bothan is met with the thought of him being a typical Bothan, then odds are he is actually likely to develop the skills he's "despised for" (whether or not he actually possesses them in the first place).

Second, and this is really only a continuation of the first, there's the issue of cultural identity. Cultural identity is primarily shaped when cultures meet. If the Bothan (who it seems was old enough to take a stand when he left home or was orphaned) spends his time growing up in a foreign society - with a foreign species, even - then it is also likely that this will trigger him being "more Bothan" and have him embrace some of that culture even if he doesn't normally associate himself with it.

Third, there's also the possibility that these "cultural" abilities actually are somewhat biologically rooted. Mind you, for instance, that Streetwise can be explained differently than simply "knowing what character to talk or not talk to" or "what street or alley to avoid". Streetwise is very much also an understanding of behavior. Having a keen sense for that might be something with deeper roots than simply culture (and the Convincing Demeanor would be an extension of that, albeit slightly more culturally rooted, I can admit).

Fourth, I actually don't agree that there aren't any so-called violent Bothans. Sure, they're political schemers, backstabbers, spies and assassins, but they still have standing armies and the need for brute protection, even among themselves. They also have this state of crisis approach to certain galactic events (it has a name that eludes me), which basically is a martial law that call all Bothans to arms to defend the species and its interests with any means necessary.

Then there's the obligation approach to it, as mentioned, which I believe holds the most merit in any case (perhaps especially so if you wanted this player to have a more story-approach to his character than he usually have).

But to sum it up: No, I don't think it will be a huge problem to simply switch some species' abilities around. It's easy to do, after all, and wouldn't hurt as long as the new abilities are on par with the old. However, I also don't think it's as easy as to say "these abilities are biological, while these are cultural". Some may be primarily one or the other, but in some (most?) instances (that aren't obvious, like claws) there might actually be a mix of the two: The streetwise example above, for instance, might be rooted in an innate sense of understanding, say, pack behavior (which would to a sapient species translate to being a little street wise).

However, if you and your player are both happy with your solution, then that's of course what's most important. I'm just tossing this in to muddle the view on abilities a little. Sure, a system for calculating point costs for species abilities would be nice, but if the idea is to shop some away while others not, then Wookiees and Trandoshans with their easily identifiable primarily physical features are in a bit of a tough spot if they want customization. To me, customization from "the norm" likely starts with obligations and ends with you career, talent and skill choices.

^ Well said, and you bring up some interesting points.  I shall ponder some of these and make a more thought out reply/retort. 

 I think it's important to remember - the paragraph describing a race's general outlook you see in RP books isn't the end-all and be-all of every individual of the species.  Just like not *every* Rodian is a bounty hunter, neither is *every* Bothan a spy.

Those 'species' descriptions are merely extremely broad generalizations.  Simply contrast the general Rodian description with the character in the Clone Wars cartoon - he was the senator from Rodia, I think, and a friend of Amidala.  He was intelligent, well spoken - and quite different from the 'every Rodian is a bounty hunting thug' generalization.  When you have a species of billions, they aren't all the same.

You can easily imagine a trandoshian poet, an ewok musician, a wookie slave-trader, or a cerean burglar.  Just like there are different kinds of humans, there are different kinds of everything else.