Old Blue said:

Lol, QFT

Anduril82 said:

you dont need to buy additional hardware. but. there are always expansion for the game, and I assume there are going to be at least 3> for new Descent. each +35USD/EUR

comparing pc games with boardgames seems stupid anyway :)

causeitwasfunny said:

I have no stake in this either way, but you seriously do not see half the miniatures for nearly the same price as a down side?

In comparison to the previous edition, I agree with your positives and they are strong points, but the negative you left out or missed or refused to include is pretty glaring.

What I do not understand is why current owners are whining when it will be the new player that will be hurting over this. The owners of previous editions buy an $80 game and a $25 upgrade kit and they are all set to go with a huge assortment of stuff to choose from and use. It's like a fairly pricey expansion.

The new buyer wont be able to get the older stuff at a reasonable price after awhile because FFG wont be printing it anymore, so it's inflated ebay prices on top of FFG charging nearly as much for about half the product miniatures wise. Who knows what the expansions in the future will look like and at what price will be charged for it.

Like I said, I do not have a stake in this either way as I do not own descent nor will I be buying the 2nd ed unless some miracle occurs. But a devil's advocacy had to be made to counter the harpsichord playing on FFG's marketing behalf.

magicrealm said:

Not all of us were losing our shirt while the market took a dive. :)

It's about where they culd price it for the minis they were going to include.  Seems about right seeing as how we knew the original game could never get reproduced at the price it was originally.

Hellfury said:

Like I said, I really don't see a problem with starting out with only 8 characters.  I understand others wanting more, but so many people out there own the 1st ed of Descent, so when you couple it with the conversion kit there's not really a huge issue.  Plus, like I mentioned, most people I know tend to stick with one, maybe two, characters anyway.

While I'm sure FFG will eventually stop printing 1st ed, it seems like they have plans to go into reprints for some of the expansions.  That tells me they plan on continuing support for the original for at least a little while longer.  It feels like they are treating 2nd ed as a very different game, but allowing users of the original to feel as though they are not left out.  Unless you work for FFG, I can't fathom why you would proclaim their plans for their product.

causeitwasfunny said:

It's not just about 8 characters. You are missing the point.

My argument is about the entire plastic content. It's cut straight in half for nearly the same price.

 As for proclaiming plans for their product. Thats your assumption of my statement. I think if you look at the precedence that FFG themselves have made over the course of YEARS, it doesnt take an employee of theirs to understand much of how they continue to support or not support games.

I just do not see the reprint status looking the same next year for this game. It will likely be all 2nd ed stuff.

They want people to buy new 2ne ed stuff, not spurn 2nd ed and continue to buy 1st ed stuff.

Hellfury said:

Right, but if you'll re-read my original post, you'll notice that I made a point to go over more than just the plastic in the game.  You're not just paying for the figures.  You're paying for art design, play-testing, working out the streamlined rules, etc.  So, I hope you'll pardon me, but I think you missed my initial point.

Speaking of plastic, just to reiterate my point on value, I also made the point that if you already own the other games (which, obviously, doesn't apply to everyone) you can purchase the conversion kit for around $20 and now have an additional 38 heroes (plus promotional heroes and the 4 from Dungeonquest) on top of the initial 8 to play in 2nd ed, as well as all of the monsters from all the games (which I'm not going to bother to count, sorry).  I know you're comparing only plastic figures that you purchase in boxes you initially pay for, but if there's a way to include figures in two separate games, I'm sorry, but that is added value anyway you slice it.

Also, I'd like to point out that you're again going over the possibility of FFG not reprinting 1st ed.  While I did say that was a possibility, I also said that 2nd ed. is different enough that they would have the opportunity to continue printing 1st and reach multiple audiences.  The fact that the conversion kit exists only assists in that line of thinking as it allows those picking up 2nd ed. to try out 1st if they had never played it.  I never made a definite statement one way or the other.  I only spoke to the possibility.  On top of that, several expansions for 1st ed. are listed in their "Upcoming" section, which would again lead me to believe that there is a continued interest in supporting it; at least in the near future.

So again, respectfully, unless you work for FFG I wouldn't recommend making a definite statement without backing it up. (e.g. "They want people to buy new 2ne stuff, not spurn 2nd ed and continue to buy 1st ed stuff").  I say, for the time being, they can do both if they want to. That's all.

Edit: As of now it looks like the Descent 1st ed products have been removed from the "Upcoming" section of FFGs website.  Now, this would push me to believe that they may not continue printing 1st ed.   However, I still stand by my statements as they were written using information available at the time.

causeitwasfunny said:

Not only from "Upcoming".

Core Box, WoD, AoD & RtL are "Not available" in the catalog

Exarkfr said:

Well, yeah.  When I started the thread it wasn't the case, so I went with that information at hand.  I still don't think it's a huge deal.  There are a some game stores in my area that have them, but I don't plan on getting them anyway.  I'm fine with starting from scratch with 2nd ed.

Hellfury said:

The quality of the miniatures and the components in general is far more important to me than the quantity.  As a painter, less miniatures of a finer quality is much more desirable than more of poorer quality.

Actually, many of the heroes in Descent weren't that well differentiated.  The skills, etc. were the things that tended to make each character unique and they, of course, are modular. 

Many of the monsters in 1st Ed. look good, like the skeletons, spiders and hounds.  However the giant with his tight pants looks silly.  And what is up with the Manticore's rock star hair? 

That being said, the overall quality of the miniatures in the first edition Descent coffin box ranged from good to pretty mediocre.  The expansion monsters had an even lower overall quality.  The surfer apes are probably the low point, unless you can't handle Gumby hands on the medusa and wraith. 

So, I'm a bit worried by the picture of the female elf with the huge shoulder pads on the 2nd Edition cover.  If that's the new style, then I'll think twice about buying this game.  However, I'm completely impressed by the graphic design of the new edition.  FFG's graphic design team has been destroying the competition in the board game design world for the past several years.  The dungeon tiles look incredible.  I'll have to wait and see the whole game laid out on a table before I comment on the rest of it, although the tokens, etc. that we've seen so far look very pretty by themselves.

Can't wait to see more previews of the components and rules. 

I'm interested to see how the conversion kit will work for the game.  Getting the old heroes into the new game seems simple enough, but how will the old monsters be incorporated?  Will they enter 2e via a spawning mechanism?  In that case, will the OL really be permitted to spawn demons and dragons?  Or will the conversion kit simply have alternative layouts for the dungeons (assuming 2e will have certain present dungeon layouts that would only incorporate 2e monsters)?  In that case how will the conversion kit compensate for the fact that some will be converting only the base, some will be converting base plus one expansion, some may be converting base plus all expansions?  Or will the rooms of the various dungeons have more of a "leader" and "minions" mechanism, where they OL can select anything (s)he wants so long as (s)he doesn't exceed a certain point value (assuming that monsters would have such values assigned).  I won't be able to tell whether the kit will be worth the price point until I know more about how it will work.

I'll side with KenToad on the fact that I'll also be influenced by the quality of the minatures--I'm also not a big fan of the art for the heroes shown on the box and hope the monster and hero figures are a bit less "cartoony."  Not that all of the 1e stuff passes that measurement standard either, though, as KenToad accurately pointed out.