I was wondering, does the Hans' Granate Werfer ignore cover? I mean, it's a grenade launcher, essentially no different from Joe's, which the rulebbok says ignore cover.

And am I the only one a little pissed at the disparity between the two Revised Set light walkers? The Blackhawk seems like a piece of crap next to the Hans, and with only a 2AP points difference. They seem to have about the same combined firepower,however the Hans has a distinct advantage with the one-hit walker kill Panzerfaust Werfer which can even seriously damage a heavy walker (1/6 !!!), and in case the Granate Werfer does ignore cover that's a huge bonus. It's also a big difference that, while the Blackhawk has a good all-around weapon, the Hans has two weapons, which allows it to simultaneously attack quite competently both a squad and a walker. The Hans also has better range, with the difference between 2 and 3 being quite a strong one. The Blackhawk's All In One skill doesn't quite make up for it, as it's a one-use thing, unlike something like Burst Weapon. Finishing it off, the Blackhawk's Fast is just slightly better than Hans' Scout skill, and in some cases Scout could be even more useful. The balance between these units is completely off.

Well Fast pretty much makes up for 1 less range as the combined move and weapon range both equal 4.  Fast is a ruddy good ability useable every turn.

Our light walkers rarely last more than 1 turn of shooting so a one-use skill is no problem at all and highly effective.  I keep persevering with Hans as on paper it looks like a good effective walker, but fails miserably every time, its to slow for a short-range arsenal and gets blown up before it can fire every time.

And on the soft cover note, I thought Hans would ignore it to, but the rules don't say that :(

I am 100% agreement with you... The Axis definitely took the edge on the Revised Core Set. Burst weapons, Hans, Lara, Laser Grenadiers that do 3 x 1/3 on heavy mechs. Hell Boys and Hammers/Rhino kick ass, but the Blackhawk and Death Dealers are pretty much worthless especially for their point values. And yeah, the whole Hans has 2 weapons and Blackhawk has 1 weapon thing with a range of 2 is upsetting as an Allied player. Though I am sure that when Operation Cerberus arrives and things take more of a confined city feel to the combat zones these could prove to be more effective. I have ranted about this on my blog, so I won't start ranting again. ha ha ha ha.

I would agree that the lack of clarification on the Granate Werfer is very weak. I wouldn't be surprised to see another FAQ soon declaring that it should be considered a grenade weapon. It would be nice to see that for "The Chef" too... The only hero released to date with no skill. Yeah the dual flames are cool and are a special weapon, but something like Assault, or maybe finally see the Fighting Spirit Skill come into play for the actual skill of the Hero. Something other than nothing basically. It seems things are a little lacking between the Walkers of the Revised Core and the Allied Hero of Operation Cerberus (Looking at the unit card, Angela looks to be pretty effective though only combat testing will tell, which I look forward to )

Yeah, it does seem like the allies got the short end of the stick in the Revised Set. And don't get me started on Lara. An armor 3 hero with Damage Resilient that can attack two light squads simultaneously doing a combined damage of 10/1, for a measly 21 points?!! Come on.

Loophole Master said:

True, but at the moment her usefulness is very limited as if she goes with the AA rocket guy's she can't sustain fire as they have to load and the heavy laser grenadiers are pretty rubbish.  Things will change when the heavy recon are released though.

Major Mishap said:

She can't sustain fire every turn, but she still can sometimes, and even if the unit is reloading and firing, they can generate 28 attack dice against an Armor 2, or 18 against an Armor 3, unit that hasn't moved.  That can generate more on average than many units using Sustained Attack.  With Lara's Assault, they can move two spaces and do that if they're already loaded.

When they actually do get to pull off a Sustained Attack against stationary targets, it gets brutal.  There's rarely much reason to do a Sustained Attack against a single stationary unit with all of that firepower.

The Heavy Recon Grenadiers will generate more than the Heavy Flak Grenadiers against moving targets, and also make a nice fit with Lara, but the threat she poses with the Flak Grenadiers can make up for the lower damage against moving targets, as it makes them move instead of use Sustained Attack themselves.

She works well with the Heavy Laser Grenadiers in a vehicle rich environment, where she maintains the unit's anti-infantry capability while they concentrate on enemy walkers.  Three 1/1's against infantry aren't a major threat, but 13/1 or 9/1 vs Armor 2 or 3, while still generating the three 1/3's against vehicles isn't bad.

 Speaking of flak grenadiers I don't think they will be particularly useful until Armor 4 infantry make an appearance but also keep in mind laser weapons are devastating on those lucky roles.

 the heavy infantry's saving grace will always be Damage Resilence. Lara is best used with those Heavy Laer Grens unless you are just fighting an infantry army. played a 500 vs 500 point game today and lara survived the whole match much to my chagrin. she is a beast

Yeah, Lara tends to last quite long in our matches as well. She's a tough nut to crack, and I'm always wary of approaching her.

I sent a question to FFG about Hans' Grenate Werfer ignoring cover. Now we only have to wait a couple of months...

Loophole Master said:

With vehicles at least, they've been pretty consistent with listing the appropriate special weapon type on the card.  (Phaser, laser, flame, etc.)  Since they didn't put it on the Hans (and because it is already a beast), we play that it doesn't ignore cover.

Well, we have several examples of  flame and grenade weapons that are supposed to ignore cover but have no special ability listed in the card (Stefan, Ozz, UGLs...).

Loophole Master said:

I did mention "with vehicles", and for simple balance purposes I'm fine not buffing up the Hans any further.

Yeah, I agree, the Hans doesn't need any extra help. I was just saying that it's quite possible that they forgot to write down the special ability in the card, and after all a "Granate Werfer" is nothing more than a "grenade launcher", and those are supposed to ignore cover, according to the rules.

Loophole Master said:

No arguement here.  In the name of playability, I'm ignoring the fact that Granate Werfer is actually a grenade thrower.  =)

Assume it's shaped charge grenades, so the blast effect is severely limited?  The piat, bazooka, panzerfaust, etc. were all throwing explosives down range, but they were less effective against infantry because of design to maximize armor penetration.  I could easily accept that as a rationale for not classing the weapon as a grenade that ignores cover.

Gimp said:

But the "Granate Werfer" is designed as an anti-infantry weapon (you can tell that by its stat line and being called a Grenade Launcher) and not anti-tank like the bazooka's, that is attached to his other arm!