The long lasting trouble behind MC already visible when the launched the Role-playing game was that they developed a wonderful world with a ton of cool features and depth but no one has managed to use the world and make it into a game that take advantage of the world. There already exist dousins of games involving soldiers in huge armour and with huge rifles. The greatness with MC lies beyond this and to make something that captures the common players is a really hard task.

Siege of the Citadel is probably the best attempt www.boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/1621 but there is not much about that game that really captures the core of MC anyhow.

When the PRG was released there were a bunch of books explaining the world behind the game but they only made 1-2 books with actual adventures. No wonder things went from worse to bad.

And yes the movie sucked big time and the only thing left from the original game was a couple of names and the title of the film.

There are several theories on this board of why Mutant Chronicles failed, some of which have merit, and others are pure speculation.

From my perspective, it is all about cost.

Since I haven't posted much on these boards, I'll give you a little background about myself. First, I do not have a history with Mutant Chronicles. Because of this, my perspective is different than many people on this discussion board. Also, I have enjoyed many ccg/cmg games over the years and spent way to much money on this hobby.  This product was designed to target the collectible market, and failed to do so properly.

My first exposure to the Mutant Chronicles CMG was at GAMA last year. Like many others who attended the show, I was given a free copy of the starter. After my return, my friends and I cracked it open, and were disappointed to learn (as many of you realize) that it is unplayable without proxies. You can't even put together the example skirmish armies in the rules.

A good starter for any ccg/cmg needs to include enough components to be playable, and allow for a few variants outside the recommend builds in the rule book. Personally, I hate one player starters. This market is competitive, and all starters should be 2 player. It is difficult to get 1 person to put down their hard earned money try and new game, even harder to convince two players. If I was in charge of brand development at Fantasy Flight for this product, it would have been a 2 faction starter with ~ 10 figures. If the launch budget allowed for it, there would have been 2 different starters featuring 4 factions. The development of the starter was the first major failure in the launch of the game.

The next contributor was the price of the boosters. At $20 a piece this is ~ $5-$7 per figure with some special figures carrying an even higher price. This is the most expensive cmg on the market. It is more expensive than Mage Knight, Heroclix, Lord of the Rings, Heroscape, D&D minis, Star Wars, MonPoc, & WOW minis. Players of these games were the target customers for this product. The average price of a mini for these games is lower than Mutant Chronicles. Over the past few years, price creep has occurred in this segment causing players to be more selective about what they buy. Pricing was mistake number 2.

The third failure was the release process. Collectible gamers expect the play environment to be dynamic. Prior to the Lost Legions release, I think only 41 figures were out. This is barely enough figures to make playing all the factions interesting. All figures needed to be on the shelves, or the cards not included in the starter at release. Only 2 figures (Karak and the Ice Golem) changed the play environment in an unexpected way. For a ccg/cmg to be successful there needs to be a constant source of change for people to discuss and experiment with. This help to generate a “buzz” in the gaming community.

For those of you that keep targeting figure size as a source of failure, please stop. It may have been a small contributor for some, but didn't really create a barrier of interest. As a reader of this and other boards, it appears that a majority of people with this complaint are former Warzone players. From this, it’s safe to assume at least one of the following:

1) You want pre-painted minis to use for other Mutant Chronicles games
2) You want to use your old figures as proxies for this version of Mutant Chronicles

The other common complaint about scale relates to the use of standard terrain. In my opinion, this is a silly argument. Just like Star Wars, Heroclix, WOW, and MonPoc this is a board game. It is not designed for the use of terrain like a miniatures skirmish. Sure some people will use it, but this is not how the game was intended to be played. If you really want terrain, Heroscape has some nice hex based pieces that could be used, and is great for creating custom maps.

Finally, for those of you that are interest on my commitment to the game here is a summary: Including the Lost Legions sets that I received yesterday I have 202 figures, and am just 18 shy of a master play set (4 of each figure). All of these have been purchased in the last 3 months since the prices have dropped. Total spent is ~ $300. That is a price per figure of ~ $1.50. As the prices fell, I bought into the game even though I assumed it would die, because I like the play mechanic and build restrictions. If the entry point for the game had been lower from the start, I would have bought more figures earlier in the launch, and been willing to pay higher than $1.50 a piece.

-Michael

That was a great analysis of the situation at hand Michael.

And you are the better shopper: I spent over $300 in the last week for just 98 figures...you gotta teach me Shop-Fu sometimes.

One item, deserving credence that I have not seen mentioned thus far, is FFG's "breaking" from the traditional MC world.  The MC universe has a large (somewhat fanatical) established population (prior to FFG creating their game.)  I believe this population is/was looking for some adherance to the familiar MC universe (example: the FFG ezoghoul looks nothing like the original ezoghoul, the look of the entire Brotherhood also feels out-of-place, as someone pointed out in another thread - no three-pronged nepharites, etc...) 

Now  FFG has used some old MC artwork (the old Mitch Hunter is used on their web-pages, command cards have old artwork, etc... )  And that old artwork lead me to believe FFG would create figs that would bring back the "feel" of the MC universe.  Though they never really did.  So when the game debutted I had no interest (I am one of the fanatical.)   I would have never bought into this game if not for my son.  He noted, the figs, though different from the original set, were still really cool.  It was only then that I realized that I might be denying myself the enjoyment of a good game based on nostalgic desires for the old look of MC.  Luckily, I gave the game a try!

Now maybe for licensing purposes FFG had to break from the old fig design and create a new style.  Regardless, I do believe this hurt them with some old die-hard fans.

Ruvion said:

In this case, my buying skills came mostly from loyalty to my LGS.

A majority of my collection comes from 3 purchases:

1) Four Lost Legions sets ~ $50

2) Three ebay auctions from 1 seller (shipping save) that bundled starters and several boosters. ~ $90

3) A distributor for my local game store ran a sale recently at a large discount. The owner let me buy at almost cost. ~ $140

tHe_MaN said:

The rest of the post can be read on page1.

I have to be honest and say that I never cared much for the miniatures game. I played Warzone a bit, but mostly because it was so closely tied to the bleedin' awesome Mutant Chronicles RPG. With CoG struggling with their new edition of the RPG, the death of the CMG, and the tear out your eyes disaster of a movie, things look grim. 

But I raise my glass to Mutant Chronicles. May it rest uneasy in it's much too shallow grave, and rise anew and kick ass!!

I think the main mistake was pure presentation of the universum. Without knowledge about everything how new players could catch the hook? Make a story, nice pictures and animations. More stuff from movie on suport page - and MC would gain new fans!

This universum is masterpiece - dont watse it!

Paragrin said:

I guess I'm confused by this. You claim the starter box needs either more figures, or proxies. But using a 28mm scale would allow them to package more figures for the same cost, and use old figures for proxies (if available). It addresses both of your complaints about the starters, but you dismiss the argument completely. You then claim that the boosters cost too much, but again: smaller figures are cheaper. Not merely in materials cost, but in painting quality, shipping costs, display space: all up and down the manufacturing chain.

I've never played Warzone. (I own a few of the books, but that's because I'm a packrat. ) But then, I've only played Pirates of the Spanish Main twice, I think. Didn't stop me from buying tons of product, because 1) it was cheap, and 2) I could use the pieces as ship tokens for any other games. I had one indie game designer actually tell me to use them for his game: he only included cheap paper stands, because he knew the market was full of decent-looking pirate ship models that were cheaper than anything he could do himself. By going 54mm, FFG cut off the secondary market, and the "cheap toys" market. I just don't see the upside here.

Yes, if you have a large scale the price goes up, no multi-game proxy, paint job looks bad, and all the other bad stuff that follows - it is the effect of that single factor, 54 scale, I agree complety with you.

Another parallel thing is the delays and format change = effect that kills hype.

A third thing parallel is that the MC license is a small, obscure universe with few hard-core fans that can't handle any changes - and to generate new customers you have to change the look of MC, since the old stuff is so colored by the early 90s over-the-top look that makes most wanna vomit.

Don't mix them.

I believe in a thrid generation products thoo, in a nother 10-15 years.

(Until then this game will be played 10-15 times a year.)

Lars said:

This is maybe because the Retro-collecting market is larger than the CMG market, LOL.

 Iv been thinking lately about it and... I got conclusion.

Of course is only "what if..." but You know.

MC is closed afted 6 months - its strange. What if its a part of FFG's marketing campaign? You know - let sell all old models, make new ones. In that time activate a fan groups and when everyone will think "its over" BAM - we got new opening?

I wish that be true...

Hm, you have a strange attitude... but I like it!

The MC curse moves in strange ways, so why not -

If I think it - it exists.

Mutant2089 said:

Well in my country its rather popular attitude. For example Media Markt closed they stores just for that they could open them in next day. And it goes big campain "New Opening MM store!!". So i thinked that why not make that way with some miniature game? Sold out old models, closed line and then - BAM! we got a new producct for You!

About MC curse - i think that KULT curse is stronger (same creators).

de99ial said:

I think the stores call it closing time. Stores in Sweden also close at night, and open in the morning with the same products for sale. It is not ony a polish thing ;P